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Discussion Starter #1
The 2011+ telelever seems to be have been one of the best traits of the bike.

Why did it go away , and i guess it makes one have to look hard a good pre one ones now lol
 

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The new liquid-cooled motor requires a radiator (or two), and the space immediately aft of the front wheel is where it'd likely go...and that space is taken by the Telelever. BMW could have hung radiators on the side (Rockster, VF800 come to mind) but didn't do that.

So I'd say packaging, or, if you're cynical, styling.
 

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Only BMW know for sure!

However, BMW did keep Telelever Front Suspension on the R12GS and RT (front Telelever has its advantages). As for it being removed on the new WC R12R, there's good reason to suggest that the above comments are true/correct. Also, if BMW wanted to keep Front Telelever Suspension on the new WC R12R, their designers (I assume) could have re-located the radiator(s) and covered/hid them with some nice body work/or similar type panels that they use on the GS?

Also in previously looking at the new WC R12R's specs., I believe its about 5/10Lb's heavier than the previous Front Telelever Suspension AC R12R, therefore maybe they removed it to keep weight down as well????
 

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I also think aesthetics played a part.. Part of their marketing to attract a younger generation of riders to it by going to a conventional fork.
 

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Our beloved Roadster, I fear, is moving aesthetically/mechanically into Retard, er, I mean, Motard world. It's still a Roadster now, but in a couple more iterations, I believe it's gonna be a high Hp wheelie machine for all the cool rich kids to ride. And, there ain't no retards, er, I'm sorry, motard bikes with telelever front ends.
 

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I'm close to 59 years old and I own and love my 2015 R1200R after approx. 9 months and 10k miles. I loved my Telelever bikes as well and wouldn't hesitate to buy another. I have no suspension dogma. If it works for me...I'm happy.
 

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I do like the look of the new R12R and a test ride was very enjoyable, but it did feel more like a "run of the mill" bike now. Not wanting to upset anyone, thats just my opinion.
I do however prefer the look of the previous model and the telelever which has been sacrifised for space, and no doubt to gain BMW a few extra sales.
Sign of the times I think.
 

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I wonder, is the Telelever front end really that much better for road bikes?
Over the years, there have been quite a few iterations of single shock front ends, and yet, the status quo still prevails. The old saying that Mr Market is always right applies here too.
 

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I would think styling was the first concern, then cost, then packaging/radiators.
If you look at the new bike, it has an odd shaped headlight, gold forks, red trellis frame... hmmm, what other naked bike are they competing with????? Ducati has taken over the segment occupied by the R12R, so in order to compete, they had to make it look more like a Ducati. The GS & RT don't suffer from that competition, so no issue there, keep the BMW identity intact. Sad they had to 'give in' to market pressures and try to look like a Ducati, but I guess it was either that or drop the model from the lineup.
 

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I wonder, is the Telelever front end really that much better for road bikes?
People have different opinions. I like it.

Over the years, there have been quite a few iterations of single shock front ends, and yet, the status quo still prevails. The old saying that Mr Market is always right applies here too.
Mr. Market is right in the sense that some things sell better than others. Beyond that, though, it doesn't mean that things that sell a lot actually are better than the things that sell less well. Inertia, sunk costs in engineering and tooling, and the attraction of the familiar also weigh in favor of telescopics.
 

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the wisdom of the internet tells that it was removed for placement of the radiator, which is sort of a unique issue on the R cf to the GS, RT and above.
The line of demarcation in the boxer line occurs between the R and the GS.

On the 2 day rideabout I had with the loaner from Santa Fe, I noticed VERY little difference and it was mostly after looking for it. Coming to a stop from slow speed seemed to "bounce" a little more in the front , but that is INFINITELY too strong a word, imo.

In my view it is a non issue. But that's just me. Spent time on twisties, slab, and stop and go pedestrian areas. It was fine. The bike to me is so far more nimble that I don't know or care if it's the new geometry or the absence of the telelever or both. Test ride one and see what you think, with your knowledge of physics and engineering in your back pocket.
 

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Like many of my peer forum members, I spend too much time reading (and dreaming) about boxers. I believe some of our telelever bikes will someday be collector items, actually appreciating in value...time will tell. Most likely though, it will be telelever bikes such as the HP2S, R1200S and a few others that achieve longer term status. But wait...as usual...I'm off on a tangent. The real purpose of this post is to share this YouTube showing an aberrant telelever concept. Try this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSFAjSuia28 Gotta love the innovative boost pressure adjustment at 4:09
 
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+1

In many ways, I think BMW's team understands and is addressing the true nature of the marketplace, in that "most" people/riders are primarily concerned with looks, color, carbon fiber etc., and the "visual" emotion/image it provides them, and also the possible admiring glances/comments they'll receive during ownership.

Don't get me wrong, there are many "good/great looking" BMW motorcycles, however in the same breath BMW is mainly known for its engineering, and that its "engineering" had equal, if not more place than "looks" (because they were about providing the best possible "riding" experience, be it an unusual approach).

In conclusion, "Telelever Front Suspension" has its advantages over telescopic front forks (BTW - if any question this, please take the time to look up, read and see how telelever "really" works (not just it looks).

If my current AC R12R were to be abducted, run over and/or destroyed, I'd try to replace with another one, or possible/maybe get a new front telelever GS or RT (IMO "personal choice" the R/RS are great, but not for me). Remember all - its Burger King "Have it your way".
 

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People have different opinions. I like it.

Mr. Market is right in the sense that some things sell better than others. Beyond that, though, it doesn't mean that things that sell a lot actually are better than the things that sell less well. Inertia, sunk costs in engineering and tooling, and the attraction of the familiar also weigh in favor of telescopics.
OK.. Looks like I owe the adherents of the Telelever suspension an apology.

A few days ago, I test rode both the new GS and a new R. I have to say I was really impressed with the GS front end especially under brakes as one enters a corner a bit hot and still keeping brakes on.

I tried the same corner entry on the R and it felt decidedly less composed.

Of course, it's impossible to fairly compare both bikes because their suspension geometry is so different. Nevertheless, I think it is fair to say that the Telelever markedly minimizes dive under brakes.

Indeed, I agree, its a shame that BMW couldn't find a way to continue with the Telelever on the R. Progress is a funny concept.

I have not seen the new RT, is the cooling system or whatever it is that precluded BMW continuing with the Telelever on the R and RS so very different?
 
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I don't know exactly when BMW adopted the Telelever front end as we know it today, but I'm aware that some BMW model(s) had an Earles-type of front suspension before that.

I will bet, however, that BMW would have made an announcement at the time of launching the Telelever to the effect that it was the latest and greatest and the best thing since the mini-skirt and so on. It would be interesting to read some of those pronouncements now, as the Telelever seems to be on the way out.


L of S
 

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Telelever

......its a shame that BMW couldn't find a way to continue with the Telelever on the R.
To be accurate, it's a shame BMW didn't see fit to continue with the Telelever on the R. The radiator taking up that space is a lame explanation. IMO
R1100R had over-the-cylinder oil coolers, R1150R had oil coolers stylishly integrated into the tank fairings.
GS_LC still has the Telelever intact, and the RT retains it, too. Not couldn't, but didn't.
Upside-down forks are used on an array of BMW models and offer BMW an economic advantage in mfg. and tooling costs.
One more step towards being a Made-in-Japan clone?
 

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.....One more step towards being a Made-in-Japan clone?... Hope your wrong!...
But, why then, did they not also ditch the Telelever for the RT? (and even the GSA and GSA?).

I guess, one has to look to the racing world to see what works best. 99+% of race bikes have conventional USD forks. So maybe, my perceptions of better stability under brakes are completely unfounded.

By way of a bit of thread drift, look at Bimota's Tesi - with its very short and spectacularly unsuccessful racing record, perhaps there is no better front end than the conventional arrangement?
 

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Bob had it nailed in post #5 - BMW's desire to attract younger riders.

Younger riders aren't attracted to RTs, and the older folks who like RTs tend to like the anti-dive and isolation from bad road surfaces that the Telelever offers. Ergo, the RT (and GS) could be continued unchanged.
 
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